Something I thought about today on the drive to uni... How do you differentiate between steroid use and steroid abuse? At which point does use become abuse?

I know very little about AAS so I can't really add much to this discussion, but I would like to know what you lot think

Lovely Jubbly

Abused is when it has an adverse effect upon you and other people.

simon m wrote:Abused is when it has an adverse effect upon you and other people.

Surely some people will suffer sides (roid rage, etc) at low sensible/suggested doses and others will not, even at high doses. So would you say those that do experience such sides at low doses are abusers?

I've recently succumb to the dark side. 500mg test enthanate a week x 10 weeks, 4 weeks of dianabol at 30mg a day run with letrozole as an AI. Other than the standard (balls and hair loss) i've not suffered any side effects, no rage, no spots, no change in personality. The gains have been huge, and i'll happily just do one small cycle a year. I think it's like any drug, generally fine unless you let it dominate your life and make it your lifestyle. People who are on all year round and hate being off cycle are abusing it IMHO.

RoB wrote:I've recently succumb to the dark side. 500mg test enthanate a week x 10 weeks, 4 weeks of dianabol at 30mg a day run with letrozole as an AI. Other than the standard (balls and hair loss) i've not suffered any side effects, no rage, no spots, no change in personality. The gains have been huge, and i'll happily just do one small cycle a year. I think it's like any drug, generally fine unless you let it dominate your life and make it your lifestyle. People who are on all year round and hate being off cycle are abusing it IMHO.

interesting what kinda gains you getting?

kp1512 wrote:

RoB wrote:I've recently succumb to the dark side. 500mg test enthanate a week x 10 weeks, 4 weeks of dianabol at 30mg a day run with letrozole as an AI. Other than the standard (balls and hair loss) i've not suffered any side effects, no rage, no spots, no change in personality. The gains have been huge, and i'll happily just do one small cycle a year. I think it's like any drug, generally fine unless you let it dominate your life and make it your lifestyle. People who are on all year round and hate being off cycle are abusing it IMHO.

interesting what kinda gains you getting?

6 weeks in I've put on a stone, gone from 14 1/2 to 15 1/2 stone most of which seems to be lean. Physique looks completely different, waist has got smaller, shoulders wider. Bench has gone up 20kg, squats up 35kg, deadlifts not really been doing much because I'm getting some serious lower back pump, but I'd imagine at least 20kg. And i've still got 4 weeks left of injections (probaly 6 weeks left of gains), very surprised as to how fast it's happened... dianabol is a helluva drug.

RoB wrote:

kp1512 wrote:

RoB wrote:I've recently succumb to the dark side. 500mg test enthanate a week x 10 weeks, 4 weeks of dianabol at 30mg a day run with letrozole as an AI. Other than the standard (balls and hair loss) i've not suffered any side effects, no rage, no spots, no change in personality. The gains have been huge, and i'll happily just do one small cycle a year. I think it's like any drug, generally fine unless you let it dominate your life and make it your lifestyle. People who are on all year round and hate being off cycle are abusing it IMHO.

interesting what kinda gains you getting?

6 weeks in I've put on a stone, gone from 14 1/2 to 15 1/2 stone most of which seems to be lean. Physique looks completely different, waist has got smaller, shoulders wider. Bench has gone up 20kg, squats up 35kg, deadlifts not really been doing much because I'm getting some serious lower back pump, but I'd imagine at least 20kg. And i've still got 4 weeks left of injections (probaly 6 weeks left of gains), very surprised as to how fast it's happened... dianabol is a helluva drug.

Those gains sound immense... what are the sides like? Is it bad hair loss?

I know mate, it's almost too good to be true. I'd imagine I'm just genetically a good responder, combined with the fact the first cycle gains are always immense and i'm far below my natural genetic potential most probably. Hair loss really is very mild but noticeable, i've never had a heavy beard and no one in the family went bald until very old, so again i've probably just hit the genetic jack pot on that one. Ball shrinkage isn't that bad either.

Oh okay. How tall are you and how long you been training mate?

Results like that make me want to start a cycle, but I think I've got a long way to go before I seriously consider it.

RoB wrote:I know mate, it's almost too good to be true. I'd imagine I'm just genetically a good responder, combined with the fact the first cycle gains are always immense and i'm far below my natural genetic potential most probably. Hair loss really is very mild but noticeable, i've never had a heavy beard and no one in the family went bald until very old, so again i've probably just hit the genetic jack pot on that one. Ball shrinkage isn't that bad either.

lol sounds dead good!

Nice, does sound like you're doing well. Totally agree with your sentiments that steroid use is very much analogous to recreational drug use - it becomes abuse when you let it take over or take it too far during the periods that you are 'on'.

You could argue that it becomes abuse when you start doing it to the obvious detriment of your health.