Appetite supressants?

Forum to discuss supplements and get general advice.

Appetite supressants?

Postby RoB on Wed Jul 15, 2009 8:56 pm

Aside from food being the obvious choice, what non-stim Appetite supressants are there on the market? If this cut is going to be successful I'm going to be in serious need of some and eph just isn't working for some reason.
User avatar
RoB
Regular Contributor
 
Posts: 499
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 2:42 am

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Rilla on Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:16 pm

Psyllum husk powder?
Big Choppa wrote:Rab's face probably scares the bar up. Explains his Shit deadlift as well cause the wants to stay away from his deformed bonce.
User avatar
Rilla
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 6556
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 9:11 pm

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby GymBunny on Thu Jul 16, 2009 8:49 am

I'll tell you what, MT2 has utterly destroyed my appetite. To the extent I threw away 1/2 my breakfast this morning because I had no interest.

I'm really enjoying the fact that dieting is not hard anymore, because I have lost interest in things like cake, fruit and basically sugar. Got loads of energy. Only thing I don't like is the fact it's put me off tea...but as I was trying to remove milk from my diet it's not that bad.
Mens sana in corpore sano
Never look back with regrets and think "what if" for that way madness lies. There are those that will envy you and try and undermine you. They are not worth your time.
User avatar
GymBunny
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 5149
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 7:40 pm
Location: homeless

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Craig on Thu Jul 16, 2009 2:11 pm

RoB wrote:Aside from food being the obvious choice, what non-stim Appetite supressants are there on the market? If this cut is going to be successful I'm going to be in serious need of some and eph just isn't working for some reason.



Isn't there something called hoodia that lowers appitite?

Where did you get your eth from?
User avatar
Craig
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 3083
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 1:51 pm

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Karlos on Thu Jul 16, 2009 6:01 pm

Appetite suppressant? Sack calorie restricting. Eat more good food if you're hungry. Don't mean to be a sexist preacher, but calorie restriction is for girrrls! (not the GB type - the treadmill skinny fat type!)

It's all about macronutrient control and good food choices.
Use discount code BSD16 for 5% off your first order
Karlos
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 3488
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 9:12 pm
Location: Liverpool

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby RoB on Thu Jul 16, 2009 6:35 pm

Craig wrote:Isn't there something called hoodia that lowers appitite?

Where did you get your eth from?


I've heard about hoodia before, i'll look into it. I've tried about 5 different places for eph, kaizen HCL, forza, 2 different steroid dealers and another random online brand i can't remember. Non seem to do much for my appetite after about a week of use.

Karlos wrote:Appetite suppressant? Sack calorie restricting. Eat more good food if you're hungry. Don't mean to be a sexist preacher, but calorie restriction is for girrrls! (not the GB type - the treadmill skinny fat type!)

It's all about macronutrient control and good food choices.


I think you are wrong about calorie restriction, energy balance is one half of the fat loss coin... macronutrient control being the other. I don't have time to be more active then I am with a full time job and exams coming up, so the only option I have is calorie control. Also my food choices are pretty sound, although i don't eat as many fruit and veg as some would reccomend, maybe two or three portions a day of a select few veg (I think fruit and veg are overated, fruit especially, with only a select few being worth while).
User avatar
RoB
Regular Contributor
 
Posts: 499
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 2:42 am

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby RoB on Thu Jul 16, 2009 6:36 pm

GymBunny wrote:I'll tell you what, MT2 has utterly destroyed my appetite. To the extent I threw away 1/2 my breakfast this morning because I had no interest.

I'm really enjoying the fact that dieting is not hard anymore, because I have lost interest in things like cake, fruit and basically sugar. Got loads of energy. Only thing I don't like is the fact it's put me off tea...but as I was trying to remove milk from my diet it's not that bad.


Interesting, I need a tan as well :D.

Rilla wrote:Psyllum husk powder?


good idea, i'll add some to a shake.
User avatar
RoB
Regular Contributor
 
Posts: 499
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 2:42 am

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Alex on Thu Jul 16, 2009 6:42 pm

As you've already pointed out eating more fruit and veg thats low impact will help plus give the added benefit of extra nutrients and improve energy levels.
'Behave like you are the best...and you'll have the best chance of being the best you can be.'

'Be effective: do what works...and keep doing it.'

'Bask in the turbulence of my magnificence.'
User avatar
Alex
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 10604
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 10:05 am

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Karlos on Thu Jul 16, 2009 6:49 pm

What bf% are you now, what you looking to get to?

Why don't you think veg is important? I think many people here will vouch for the positive effects of veg on body composition.

I'm only trying to argue this point because I've had great results recently simply by eating a good amount of fat, veg and protein and busting my arse in the gym 3 times a week, with no hunger at all to battle with.

I've tried cal restriction in the past (more than once) and failed due to hunger getting the best of me.

Appetite surpressents...eat a bag of frozen broccoli? :P
Use discount code BSD16 for 5% off your first order
Karlos
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 3488
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 9:12 pm
Location: Liverpool

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Alex on Thu Jul 16, 2009 7:00 pm

Karlos wrote:What bf% are you now, what you looking to get to?

Why don't you think veg is important? I think many people here will vouch for the positive effects of veg on body composition.

I'm only trying to argue this point because I've had great results recently simply by eating a good amount of fat, veg and protein and busting my arse in the gym 3 times a week, with no hunger at all to battle with.

I've tried cal restriction in the past (more than once) and failed due to hunger getting the best of me.

Appetite surpressents...eat a bag of frozen broccoli? :P


Talks sense.
'Behave like you are the best...and you'll have the best chance of being the best you can be.'

'Be effective: do what works...and keep doing it.'

'Bask in the turbulence of my magnificence.'
User avatar
Alex
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 10604
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 10:05 am

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby RoB on Thu Jul 16, 2009 7:03 pm

I certainly do think its important, but not to the degree of eating 10 portions a day lol. An onion or two, 3-4 tomatoes in sauces and a portion of Sauerkraut/beatroot is more then enough when combined with decent cuts of meat and organs I think. I'm about 14-15 at the moment and i'm gunning for 9-10% within 12 weeks, unfortuantly i've got a pretty high set point and a ridiculously adaptive metabolism. I can mantain 95kg weight on 2500kcals a day (low carbs) whilst being active. Which is why once i've got rid of this fat i plan on staying around 10-12% year round.
User avatar
RoB
Regular Contributor
 
Posts: 499
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 2:42 am

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Karlos on Thu Jul 16, 2009 7:11 pm

RoB wrote:I certainly do think its important, but not to the degree of eating 10 portions a day lol.

Sounds like a great idea to me :D

unfortuantly i've got a pretty high set point and a ridiculously adaptive metabolism.


Isn't that a good reason to not go down the calorie restriction route? Maybe a carbo cycling approach would work better?
Use discount code BSD16 for 5% off your first order
Karlos
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 3488
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 9:12 pm
Location: Liverpool

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Alex on Thu Jul 16, 2009 7:20 pm

Karlos wrote:Isn't that a good reason to not go down the calorie restriction route? Maybe a carbo cycling approach would work better?


I've doing a form of this of late while I'm training early afternoons; a small amount of carbs as part of breakfast, carbs in the form of green veg and brown basmati rice with chicken either side of workout and then usually carbs in the form of lots green veg for dinner. Fats are added in of course but this is just to outline carb intake.
'Behave like you are the best...and you'll have the best chance of being the best you can be.'

'Be effective: do what works...and keep doing it.'

'Bask in the turbulence of my magnificence.'
User avatar
Alex
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 10604
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 10:05 am

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby RoB on Thu Jul 16, 2009 7:31 pm

Karlos wrote:
RoB wrote:I certainly do think its important, but not to the degree of eating 10 portions a day lol.

Sounds like a great idea to me :D

unfortuantly i've got a pretty high set point and a ridiculously adaptive metabolism.


Isn't that a good reason to not go down the calorie restriction route? Maybe a carbo cycling approach would work better?


haha, we've come full circle and agree with each other. I'm cycling carbs now... protein and fats stay the same but on low days the carbs come down to 75g which means i'm only on about 1900-2000 kcals a day (surround by food all day in a kitchen my hunger pangs get ridiculous).
User avatar
RoB
Regular Contributor
 
Posts: 499
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 2:42 am

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Dtlv74 on Thu Jul 16, 2009 8:06 pm

I think i (and anyone else who reacts like this) must have really good leptin responsiveness because i can't do big calorie changes either up or down... if i try to bulk and raise my calories i get so fidgety and energetic that i find it hard to sit still or even sleep properly... but if i drop my kcals i just feel like i want to sleep all the time. The weird thing is that my maintenance calories are roughly around 2,500 daily and it only takes a shift up or down by a few hundred kcals sustained for a day or two for me to experience either of the above.

For me when i want to drop bodyfat i have a couple of lower carb days each week but at the same time have to keep kcals the same or even raise them slightly and do extra cardio - if i restrict calories then i quickly become lethargic, apathetic and sleepy.

Am lucky i'm fairly lean naturally and happy with my normal bodyfat level (around 11-12%). If I had to go on a major cut where it looked like I'd have to give a sustained go at kcal restriction i think I'd go insane!
User avatar
Dtlv74
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 3048
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 8:50 pm
Location: SW England

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby RoB on Thu Jul 16, 2009 8:22 pm

Dtlv74 wrote:I think i (and anyone else who reacts like this) must have really good leptin responsiveness because i can't do big calorie changes either up or down... if i try to bulk and raise my calories i get so fidgety and energetic that i find it hard to sit still or even sleep properly... but if i drop my kcals i just feel like i want to sleep all the time. The weird thing is that my maintenance calories are roughly around 2,500 daily and it only takes a shift up or down by a few hundred kcals sustained for a day or two for me to experience either of the above.

For me when i want to drop bodyfat i have a couple of lower carb days each week but at the same time have to keep kcals the same or even raise them slightly and do extra cardio - if i restrict calories then i quickly become lethargic, apathetic and sleepy.

Am lucky i'm fairly lean naturally and happy with my normal bodyfat level (around 11-12%). If I had to go on a major cut where it looked like I'd have to give a sustained go at kcal restriction i think I'd go insane!


You lucky bugger... i wish there was a pill that reduces the bodys BF set point by 5 percent. I have been looking into ways of lowering the bodyfat set point and did come across this paper which argues that the set point is regulated by flavor-calorie associations. Like an inbuilt Pavlovian response to the fluctuation of food availability with the seasons. From an evolutionary perspective, flavoursome food would be more abundant in the summer (fruits, honey etc) which would signal the body to lay down the fat for winter. Haven't had time to read though all the research or paper yet so could be getting the wrong end of the stick... looks interesting though.

http://sethroberts.net/about/whatmakesfoodfattening.pdf
User avatar
RoB
Regular Contributor
 
Posts: 499
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 2:42 am

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Dtlv74 on Fri Jul 17, 2009 2:37 pm

RoB wrote:
Dtlv74 wrote:I think i (and anyone else who reacts like this) must have really good leptin responsiveness because i can't do big calorie changes either up or down... if i try to bulk and raise my calories i get so fidgety and energetic that i find it hard to sit still or even sleep properly... but if i drop my kcals i just feel like i want to sleep all the time. The weird thing is that my maintenance calories are roughly around 2,500 daily and it only takes a shift up or down by a few hundred kcals sustained for a day or two for me to experience either of the above.

For me when i want to drop bodyfat i have a couple of lower carb days each week but at the same time have to keep kcals the same or even raise them slightly and do extra cardio - if i restrict calories then i quickly become lethargic, apathetic and sleepy.

Am lucky i'm fairly lean naturally and happy with my normal bodyfat level (around 11-12%). If I had to go on a major cut where it looked like I'd have to give a sustained go at kcal restriction i think I'd go insane!


You lucky bugger... i wish there was a pill that reduces the bodys BF set point by 5 percent. I have been looking into ways of lowering the bodyfat set point and did come across this paper which argues that the set point is regulated by flavor-calorie associations. Like an inbuilt Pavlovian response to the fluctuation of food availability with the seasons. From an evolutionary perspective, flavoursome food would be more abundant in the summer (fruits, honey etc) which would signal the body to lay down the fat for winter. Haven't had time to read though all the research or paper yet so could be getting the wrong end of the stick... looks interesting though.

http://sethroberts.net/about/whatmakesfoodfattening.pdf


Looks interesting... and makes sense on the face of it.


Yeah I'm really lucky... the fattest i've ever been was two years ago (ironically when limiting carbs, although overall kcals were high) when i came in at 13.5% b/fat with the calipers.

Just been looking at the herbal Hoodia gordonii for supressing appetite. There seems to be quite a lot of interest in it from the scienific and supplement industries but not actually that much reliable data showing exactly how it works.

A brief review of hoodia.
User avatar
Dtlv74
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 3048
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 8:50 pm
Location: SW England

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Dtlv74 on Fri Jul 17, 2009 3:24 pm

Found the hoodia abstract i was looking for!

Increased ATP content/production in the hypothalamus may be a signal for energy-sensing of satiety: studies of the anorectic mechanism of a plant steroidal glycoside.

MacLean DB, Luo LG.

Division of Endocrinology, Hallett Center for Diabetes and Endocrinology, Brown Medical School, Coro Building Providence, RI 02903, USA. david_b_maclean@brown.edu

A steroidal glycoside with anorectic activity in animals, termed P57AS3 (P57), was isolated from Hoodia gordonii and found to have homologies to the steroidal core of cardiac glycosides. Intracerebroventricular (i.c.v.) injections of the purified P57AS3 demonstrated that the compound has a likely central (CNS) mechanism of action. There is no evidence of P57AS3 binding to or altering activity of known receptors or proteins, including Na/K-ATPase, the putative target of cardiac glycosides. The studies demonstrated that the compound increases the content of ATP by 50-150% in hypothalamic neurons. In addition, third ventricle (i.c.v.) administration of P57, which reduces subsequent 24-h food intake by 40-60%, also increases ATP content in hypothalamic slice punches removed at 24 h following the i.c.v. injections. In related studies, in pair fed rats fed a low calorie diet for 4 days, the content of ATP in the hypothalami of control i.c.v. injected animals fell by 30-50%, which was blocked by i.c.v. injections of P57AS3. With growing evidence of metabolic or nutrient-sensing by the hypothalamus, ATP may be a common currency of energy sensing, which in turn may trigger the appropriate neural, endocrine and appetitive responses as similar to other fundamental hypothalamic homeostatic centers for temperature and osmolarity.

original

User avatar
Dtlv74
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 3048
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 8:50 pm
Location: SW England

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby ollie on Tue Aug 11, 2009 5:08 pm

RoB wrote:
Dtlv74 wrote:I think i (and anyone else who reacts like this) must have really good leptin responsiveness because i can't do big calorie changes either up or down... if i try to bulk and raise my calories i get so fidgety and energetic that i find it hard to sit still or even sleep properly... but if i drop my kcals i just feel like i want to sleep all the time. The weird thing is that my maintenance calories are roughly around 2,500 daily and it only takes a shift up or down by a few hundred kcals sustained for a day or two for me to experience either of the above.

For me when i want to drop bodyfat i have a couple of lower carb days each week but at the same time have to keep kcals the same or even raise them slightly and do extra cardio - if i restrict calories then i quickly become lethargic, apathetic and sleepy.

Am lucky i'm fairly lean naturally and happy with my normal bodyfat level (around 11-12%). If I had to go on a major cut where it looked like I'd have to give a sustained go at kcal restriction i think I'd go insane!


You lucky bugger... i wish there was a pill that reduces the bodys BF set point by 5 percent. I have been looking into ways of lowering the bodyfat set point and did come across this paper which argues that the set point is regulated by flavor-calorie associations. Like an inbuilt Pavlovian response to the fluctuation of food availability with the seasons. From an evolutionary perspective, flavoursome food would be more abundant in the summer (fruits, honey etc) which would signal the body to lay down the fat for winter. Haven't had time to read though all the research or paper yet so could be getting the wrong end of the stick... looks interesting though.

http://sethroberts.net/about/whatmakesfoodfattening.pdf


Makes a lot of sense.

Flavours are incredibly powerful unconditioned stimuli. Pairing them with just about anything that provides an evolutionary advantage; e.g. satiety, tends to elicit a conditioned response.

RoB - it does sound as though you're eating too little. If you've done so chronically then it would explain why you're holding on to fat so readily, although I guess you know that.
User avatar
ollie
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 4821
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2008 11:47 pm
Location: London

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby health4ni on Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:08 pm

I think you are wrong about the vegetables & fruits thing. Most vegetables are so good for you and there are some great fruits.

If you upped the amount of veg you ate you'd get loads more fibre that would keep you fuller for longer (in a similar way to psyllium husk that Rilla suggested) and thus you'd eat less overall and less calories... esp since veg & some fruit are low calories.

One of the most nutrient dense and filling dinners I've had recently is fried courgette &/or broccoli with quinoa and blended chick peas. Add some chilli/cayenne pepper & herbs for some extra flavour & punch, then drizzle on some olive oil and you're good to go.

The point of posting that was simply to show you a good nutritious non-meat meal that will keep you full for a long time and is quite low in calories. Adding some meat is easy if you like though.
Cluster Training
http://health4ni.com/ :: BSD Discount Code: BSD6505
User avatar
health4ni
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 5532
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:58 am
Location: Belfast, UK

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Dtlv74 on Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:16 pm

health4ni wrote:One of the most nutrient dense and filling dinners I've had recently is fried courgette &/or broccoli with quinoa and blended chick peas. Add some chilli/cayenne pepper & herbs for some extra flavour & punch, then drizzle on some olive oil and you're good to go.


Damn thats made me hungry! Sounds nice :D
User avatar
Dtlv74
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 3048
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 8:50 pm
Location: SW England

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby ollie on Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:27 pm

Chick peas are amazingly filling.

Another good one:

Grate some lemon zest and mix with a few tbsp of olive oil. Brush onto a cod fillet. Grill.

Fry up some sliced onions and garlic in coconut oil, and at the last minute throw in some spinach, chilli and your freshly cooked chick peas (the ones you buy dried are best, they need soaking overnight).

Dump that lot on a plate, sit the cod and top. Done. Fresh ingredients, simply prepared :D
User avatar
ollie
Ultimate Contributor
 
Posts: 4821
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2008 11:47 pm
Location: London

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby RoB on Wed Aug 12, 2009 7:17 pm

health4ni wrote:
One of the most nutrient dense and filling dinners I've had recently is fried courgette &/or broccoli with quinoa and blended chick peas. Add some chilli/cayenne pepper & herbs for some extra flavour & punch, then drizzle on some olive oil and you're good to go.


ollie wrote:Chick peas are amazingly filling.

Another good one:

Grate some lemon zest and mix with a few tbsp of olive oil. Brush onto a cod fillet. Grill.

Fry up some sliced onions and garlic in coconut oil, and at the last minute throw in some spinach, chilli and your freshly cooked chick peas (the ones you buy dried are best, they need soaking overnight).

Dump that lot on a plate, sit the cod and top. Done. Fresh ingredients, simply prepared :D


They both sound aweseome /drool. Will try both out this week and report back.

I have stumbled on the awnser to my hunger pangs on the low carb/low calorie days now though. Too much protein, too little fat! I've been going for chicken/white fish as my main protein sources and these are just too lean, worked out that i was getting 60% of my calories from protein, 30 from fat and 10% from carbs on low days. Switched it up to 60F 30P 10C and its made a world of difference. Makes sense considering most of the feedback systems in the GI tract for satiety work on the presence of lipid in the chyme.
User avatar
RoB
Regular Contributor
 
Posts: 499
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 2:42 am

Re: Appetite supressants?

Postby Rorschach on Mon Aug 17, 2009 1:26 am

Tried smoking?
User avatar
Rorschach
Popular Member
 
Posts: 869
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2008 10:42 am


Return to Supplements

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 31 guests

cron