Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

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Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby health4ni on Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:33 pm

http://theflucase.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1611%3Adoctors-protest-israels-decision-to-give-toxic-focetria-and-pandemrix-jabs-to-people&catid=1%3Alatest-news&Itemid=64&lang=en

A really good letter supported with studies showing that giving the Focetria (Novartis) and Pandemrix (GSK) (this being the main one given to UK people) swine flu vaccines is very risky.

A client of mine who is a consultant doctor for infectious diseases at a local hospital (and other things, not sure of her full title) found the letter interesting and forwarded to a colleague who is giving a presentation to many other doctors in Ireland about the vaccines. I'm unsure of how they respond to the info but it;s there for them.

It's been of great concern to me recently since as my wife is 6 months pregnant they want to jab her with it. I'm against it; even though everyone else says take it.

My concerns are two-fold:
1. H1N1 vaccines have not been adequately tested; the test is now a "Live" one. The US, UK etc population are testing these vaccines for the drug companies. And the drug companies have been given complete immunity (pun intended) from any law suits relating to side-effects from the vaccines.
2. The adjuvant/excipients contained in these vaccines are shocking (link & link). Thimerosal (mercury) (linked to autism... not to mention all the other effects mercury can have on your body) & polysorbate 80 (linked to infertility) & squalene (linked to auto-immune diseases) are not exactly nice substances (esp together) to inject straight into your blood stream.

As humans living in a very toxic world we are in contact with many toxins like those above. But for a company to add them to a vaccine that gets injected directly into a person's blood stream is madness.

Pandemrix wrote:There are currently no data available on the use of Pandemrix in pregnancy. Data from pregnant
women vaccinated with different inactivated non-adjuvanted seasonal vaccines do not suggest
malformations or fetal or neonatal toxicity.
link

Focetria wrote:There are currently no data available on the use of Focetria in pregnancy. Data from pregnant women vaccinated with different inactivated non-adjuvanted seasonal vaccines do not suggest malformations or fetal or neonatal toxicity.
link

Not very reassuring is it.

There is another vaccine called Celvapan (Baxter) that does not contain any mercury, polysorbate and squalene (link).

Now I still don't like it. And it also says the same about "no data available" for pregnancy etc, but as it doesn't contain some of the nasty ingredients then that is what I'll be recommending my wife goes for if she decides to have the vaccine.

Official European Medicines Agency info here: http://www.emea.europa.eu/influenza/vaccines/home.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby Rab on Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:53 pm

Its a tricky one.

Id tent to go behind the scientific consensus on this issue as if you go looking for issues regarding it, you sure as hell will find them

Maybe just wing it but if (touch wood) your wife did get swine flu and lost the baby and possibly her own life.....

Not an easy decision but I think you have to go with the consensus of the scientific community...and maybe settle for the least risky option.

Dont envy your position though mate.
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby simon m on Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:56 pm

I wouldn't want my wife to take such a thing whilst pregnant and many people in the UK (over 50%) are refusing to take the jab when offered it.

However, MMR jab really should be given to children.
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby health4ni on Thu Nov 19, 2009 4:09 pm

Rab wrote:Its a tricky one.
It is indeed. It's not really my decision though. Ultimately it's hers. She has said that if she wasn't pregnant then she wouldn't get it. But the baby changes things.

I think in a few years the whole Swine Flu thing will be looked at as over-reaction.

@MMR: interesting that. From my look at all the vaccines the babies & children get, it seems to me to be more to do with the amount of toxic adjuvants/excipients that are in each vaccine that "build-up" in the childs body that then lead to conditions such as autism. MMR is the last on a long list of vaccines and seems to be the one that breaks the camels back. More so if the mother is eating poorly (via breast milk to baby) and/or baby/child is eating poorly. I think it's worth getting mind you. But do all vaccines need to be given??

My doctor client believes one useful way to help minimise risks is to space the vaccinations out. Not all so close together. Still, that's like an admission of something's bad with them...
Last edited by health4ni on Fri Nov 20, 2009 2:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby simon m on Thu Nov 19, 2009 4:15 pm

MMR really is very safe, I can assure you of that as my children had it and I really looked at that closely. Not having MMR is too great a risk to take.
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby Will on Thu Nov 19, 2009 4:21 pm

simon m wrote:I wouldn't want my wife to take such a thing whilst pregnant and many people in the UK (over 50%) are refusing to take the jab when offered it.

However, MMR jab really should be given to children.


I'd rather pay to get the individual injections as I did in France instead of MMR. A lot of the stink might have been reactionary and not accurate - but hey, it did me no harm :) But I agree if I had the choice of MMR or nothing, I'd choose MMR.
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby kp1512 on Thu Nov 19, 2009 5:31 pm

agree totally - dont take the vaccine. Its been rushed through without implications. it just aitn right.

Also - gota remember that if your immune is upto par itll fight it anyway
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby health4ni on Thu Nov 19, 2009 5:40 pm

^^ exactly. But then the media report just last week that some pregnant woman died from swine flu in Dublin. Very sad of course, but you know nothing about their general health etc.
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby GymBunny on Thu Nov 19, 2009 5:42 pm

Although the specifics of vaccine development is not my area of expertise, I'd say no to the swine flu jab anyway and as for giving it to a pregnant lady, nope. There is a lot of anger/worry in the scientific community about distributing a vaccine that has not been properly tested and frankly the vaccine being given wasn't developed specifically for this illness.
Secondly, those people I know who, due to work or whatever reason, that have had to have it, have been more ill than people who've had full blown swine flu.

As for MMR, ha! Fuss over nothing. If you read the studies and statistics that link it to autism. Nope, definitely not convinced.

That said, I am pretty sure, tho I have no evidence to back this theory up, that the increase in allergies, asthma and so on are due to a lack of exposure to being outside and playing in the dirt as kids. Well that coupled with the lack of nutrients and prepackaged food.

But I shall get off my soapbox now, dispense with the sweeping generalisations and handwaving and return to work.
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby Resurrected on Thu Nov 19, 2009 5:43 pm

Thalidomide (still used today some may be surprised to know) was a safe drug! Remember.
Thoughts determine what you want... Actions determine what you get!


Why are Chavs like slinkies? They have no real use but it's great to watch one fall down a flight of stairs.
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby Dtlv74 on Thu Nov 19, 2009 6:35 pm

A point on all vaccinations - while they increase immunity to the specific disease vaccinated, they also significantly lower overall cell mediated immunity. In the case of combination vaccines normally a greater than 70% permanent reduction in immunoglobulin A antibodies. MMR and DTP vaccines fall into this category.

Vaccines have done wonders for human health, making certain diseases that once would destroy whole populations a thing of the past... but the downside is that they influence and alter the way the immune system distinguishes between pathogens and the cells of the body, they affect human dna and proteins, and there are definite links between these alterations and susceptibility to other conditions and illnesses. There are plenty of other issues too.

I would avoid all vaccinations as much as possible, and only consider them if in a significant risk group.
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby health4ni on Fri Nov 20, 2009 2:53 pm

Dtlv74 wrote:I would avoid all vaccinations as much as possible, and only consider them if in a significant risk group.
And this is how they play it with regards to pregnant women. I might let my wife read this thread. It probably will just make matters worse though :?
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby Dtlv74 on Fri Nov 20, 2009 7:18 pm

health4ni wrote:
Dtlv74 wrote:I would avoid all vaccinations as much as possible, and only consider them if in a significant risk group.
And this is how they play it with regards to pregnant women. I might let my wife read this thread. It probably will just make matters worse though :?


From my understanding of it, the three most important things to help a baby develop good natural immunity are 1) breast feed, 2) minimal vaccination, 3) avoiding totally sterile environments and excessive use of cleaning products. Diet is also vital when on the solids... but then have no doubt that a health4ni baby will have that sorted :)
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby Spit on Mon Nov 23, 2009 12:15 pm

A timely article, in a semi-related sort of way:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8373690.stm
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Re: Doctors protest Israel's decision to give Swine Flu Jab

Postby julesm on Mon Nov 23, 2009 12:35 pm

it transpires that my nipper has an egg allergy- makes it serious fun when it does come to vaccination time, as most are derived from eggs
i have been assurred it is safe for her to have- but a crash team would be to hand

i am going through hell at the moment with her, she is now at nursery and is catching everything, which in turn gets passed onto me. I can honestly say i have not been 100% for about 10 weeks- my immunosuppressant alcohol habit doesnt help but........
i was thinking as to why this was..............dead simple, last year she was breastfeeding and thus getting the necessary immunity from her mum- this year, she is just fair game for anything
so breast feeding is without a shadow of a doubt the best (breast) thing for those first few months to guarantee safe passage
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